Pat's WVO thread

FL cruiser

 
 
Joined
Jul 22, 2004
Messages
1,663
Location
St Petersburg, Florida
A check valve isn't a bad idea, and in theory the closer to the fuel source the better. I wouldn't put it in the tank the tank though. The veggie in the tank will generate it's own particles or "fallout". You can filter the veggie down to two microns before putting it in the tank, and the pickup tube will still clog at the elbow and other high resistance areas. A big mystery. I suspect the veggie on the roof of the tank and filler neck areas makes contact with oxygen and solidifies into particles.

It might be a better idea to put it just outside the tank where you have access to it because there is the possibility it could be a particle catcher.
 
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
1,378
Location
Coldest N. America
... The veggie in the tank will generate it's own particles or "fallout". You can filter the veggie down to two microns before putting it in the tank, and the pickup tube will still clog at the elbow and other high resistance areas. A big mystery. ...
No big mystery.
In most cases the 'fallout' is fats and PHO that were melted by the heat used during filtering, which later precipitate out as the UVO cools, clogging intake screens and filters.
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
926
Location
Pinellas County Florida
Just when I thought I was ready to install the tank and do some testing, I came across one of these in the classified:



image-1356025491.jpg

A non US market dual filler neck. I don't know what I like better- the fact that I got a hold of one, or that I only paid $20 for it. I was going to just hide away a filler tube somewhere.

The modding for this will prolong the tank install, but worthwhile.

Pat
 

MrMoMo

That's not rust, it's Canadian patina...
 
Joined
Nov 11, 2005
Messages
2,451
Location
~Kingston, ON, pero soñando de Panamá
I ordered a check valve to install in the tank on the pickup straw. My concern is that the veggie will flow backward while sitting, filling the entire (11 foot) fuel line with air- which would then get sucked into the filter, IP, etc.

Pat
If you have this as a problem, you've got leaking fuel lines anyway. There should be nowhere for air to enter the system. If the air can't get in, the veggie won't flow backwards....
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
926
Location
Pinellas County Florida
If you have this as a problem, you've got leaking fuel lines anyway. There should be nowhere for air to enter the system. If the air can't get in, the veggie won't flow backwards....
Yep, that's a good point. I do think I have an air leak in my fuel line, more than likely in the tank on the pick up tube. Here's a video of it running with clear fuel lines. Looking at the fuel lines, You can see that something isn't right in there.

http://youtu.be/XfnNIqoDZsY

That hard start issue went on for about three days and then mysteriously fixed itself.
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
926
Location
Pinellas County Florida
My progress is been slow lately because I've been focusing on family (well I guess that is progress) I've mostly been doing petty stuff like running Wires for fuel gauge sender, gauges etc.

But today I got my dual filler neck installed. Tomorrow I'm going to see if I can't get the tank installed so I can start testing.



image-3710134042.jpg

I still need to figure out some mechanism to actuate the valve, but that'll be easy.

Pat
 
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
1,378
Location
Coldest N. America
It's common for clear plastic fuel lines to get harder with use, and when this happens the hose clamps are often not making a good seal anymore. If the air leak is in the tank, then when the tank is completely full the air bubbles should stop. The most likely spot to air leak is where the fuel tube attaches to the tank connection.
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
926
Location
Pinellas County Florida
The clear fuel lines have only been on a month, so that's not it. Also, IIRC, I made that video on a full tank. I think the the 80s have short rubber lines on top of the tank that connects the main hard lines to the tank pick up. I'll have to check into this at some point.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
926
Location
Pinellas County Florida
I haven't been able to update this thread in a while because I've been focusing on other projects.

I'm still having weird fuel issues which has been slowing down my progress. I changed my fuel filter a few days ago to find that the old filter was filled with weird waxy flakes. (I started another thread regarding this)
https://forum.ih8mud.com/index.php?threads/Soft-flakes-found-in-fuel-filter-during-change.808051/

Today, while running a few errands of less than a few miles drive, the engine died out on me several times due to fuel starvation. I could drive about 1/8 mile before the engine died out and I'd have to bleed the injectors. I actually putted home this way-1/8 mile at a time..

When the engine died out, I would disconnect the fuel line and try to suck fuel through it, but it was plugged. After a minute or two though, the Fuel would start flowing a little bit again. My guess is that the same waxy flakes are floating around in the fuel tank and my fuel sock is still attached to my fuel pick up. I'll find out tomorrow when I open it up.

I'll admit, I'm getting a little discouraged with WVO. I'm not even running it full-time yet-only 30% blend at this point. I must have gotten some bad WVO. But heck, I centrifuge it. That's more than most people do.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
926
Location
Pinellas County Florida
I'm still having weird fuel issues which has been slowing down my progress. I changed my fuel filter a few days ago to find that the old filter was filled with weird waxy flakes.

(I started another thread regarding this)
https://forum.ih8mud.com/index.php?threads/Soft-flakes-found-in-fuel-filter-during-change.808051/


I'll admit, I'm getting a little discouraged with WVO. I'm not even running it full-time yet-only 30% blend at this point. I must have gotten some bad WVO. But heck, I centrifuge it. That's more than most people do.
Another clogged fuel filter at $15 a pop after maybe 100- 150 miles.. The 30% blend of WVO is saving me about 20 bucks on a fill up so now I guess I'm getting about a $5 savings. It's going to take a while to return this investment.
 
Joined
Dec 10, 2003
Messages
492
There's something else at work here. Either your plumbing or your mix. You should not clog that quickly. I don't and I've been doing it for 10 years. You must blend in gas, ulsd and svo alone will clog for instance. Also, if your plumbing has created a negative pressure loop your pump will starve making it act like a clogged filter but it really is not. A FPHE prior to your filter will allow you to filter very hot oil making clogging far far less frequent.
 
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
1,378
Location
Coldest N. America
The "weird waxy flakes" are probably fats and PHO settling out of the mix when it cools below 65°F. Not uncommon at all. See msg 24 above.
Why is it still a mystery?

Cold fuel containing UVO is often a problem. Like MH states in the previous message, add petrol to the mix and add a FPHE to heat the mix before the filter. The fuel mix should also be cold settled then cold filtered into the vehicle tank, or fats will clog the fuel inlet screen in the tank.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
926
Location
Pinellas County Florida
As of right now, I am not and have never diluted my WVO with RUG. I didn't know it was necessary with a 30% mix in diesel. Maybe that's my problem-I'll give it a shot. 15% RUG okay?

I do cold settle, keep in mind though, in Florida right now that is about 80°. I don't think the nighttime weather right now is dipping much below 80° but it does seem these flakes are settling in the tank or at least the filter.

I do have a FPHE installed but it's just sitting in limbo right now waiting for my two tank system to be finished. I read somewhere that it is not good to send heated diesel fuel to the injection pump because the heat reduces its lubricating properties. I've also heard that WVO increases lubricating properties. Maybe I should plumb my fuel lines through the FPHE?
 
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
1,378
Location
Coldest N. America
Melting point of Fats °C / °F

Beef tallow..............40-50 / 104-122
Pork lard................ 34-44 / 93-111
Poultry fat...............23-40 / 73-104
Hydrogenated VO.....35-65 / 95-150


Some of these fats will be in most UVO
 
Joined
Dec 10, 2003
Messages
492
The fats John mentioned are not necessarily bad, in fact they contain more energy. The trouble is they are solids at higher temperature and need to be liquid to be useable. I've plumbed my truck around 4 times completely from scratch and have experienced the results of each version. It is important for a hassle free set up to have your FPHE b/t the tank and your filter.
 
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
1,378
Location
Coldest N. America
I agree with m_h. The FPHE before the filter is necessary to avoid the "waxy flakes" regardless of where they're coming from. Heat the fuel to 140°F or hotter and it's likely the problems will disappear.

The simple system on my 13B-T is a FPHE between the fuel feed pump and the filter, and a clear inline diesel fuel filter after the OEM water-separator/sedimenter. I seasonally adjust the blend of UVO-biodiesel-kerosene-petrol-ULSD and cold filter it, so it doesn't gel in the fuel tank and clog the intake screen when it gets cold in the winter. I usually pump fuel into the vehicle tank in the morning so the fuel mix barrel is still at the overnight temperature. Most 'stuff' settles to the bottom of the barrel, and any floating particles are caught by the 5µ filter on the barrel pump outlet.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Dec 24, 2012
Messages
23
Location
West Seattle
I am also getting air in my fuel line. I have clear polyethylene fuel line so it is easy to see. I don't yet have my WVO setup installed so not many places for it to be introduced. I can see that it is dripping from near the tank. I felt the hose between the tank and metal hard line, it didn't seem overly wet , just a little film on it. I am going to switch all fuel line to the previously mentioned Gates barricade. I got mine at O'reilly's. Did you make your own centrifuge or buy a commercially available unit? For my WVO filler neck I canibalized a complete fuel door assembly that will be installed on the other side of the vehicle.
 
Top Bottom